阿巴森

印度会从一个男性主导的社会转变为女性主导吗

Is India going from a male-dominated society to a female-dominated one?

印度会从一个男性主导的社会转变为女性主导吗?

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以下是Quora读者的评论:

Sumit Sakore

To answer the question, “going from”, may be YES, if we do not modify the course down the line BUT we are far away from the concept of female-dominated society.

Let’s see some facts & why I think so?

要回答这个问题,“转向”,如果我们不改变目前的路线,答案也许是肯定的,但我们的社会距离女性主导还很遥远。

让我们看看一些事实,以及为什么我是这样认为的?

  • Mother’s name is mandatory in schools. So the old days when father’s name was mandatory, Now mother’s name is mandatory & father name is an option[1]
  • Women is a head of family now. Since I moved to Pune recently, my dad went to transfer ration card from Mumbai to Pune. A notable thing I heard there is women will be the head of family no matter she is earning or not as per NFSA
  • No mother name on certificates? I completed my school in year 2001 and my school certificate have my mother name along with father name that I got from Mumbai University. Recently HC said that mother name is sufficient for passport, no need of father’s name in case of single parent
  • Marriage expense: There are many communities in India, even in Maharashtra where I stay who divides the expenditure of marriage equally. Please excuse me but honeymoon is not only a pleasure for men if you know little bit about Human Biology. I never heard this expense is equally divided.
  • Custody of child. Not only in India but across the world, in most of the cases, mother gets the custody of child. Apolo Aton Ohno, winner of 8 Olympics medal was raised by his father & had little interest in his mother
  • Girls has to move away from their family. I was born & brought-up in Mumbai now living in Pune. I see many couples staying in a separate house without in-laws. So why do you think that only girl had to leave her parents? I have many friends from different part of country, some are from Bihar, UP, TN, AP, Delhi even various parts of Maharashtra such as Kolhapur, Solapur etc. where there are no much growth of industrialization or many be the job location, so they had to leave their homes long back even for studies & jobs. Don’t you think men suffers same homesickness, again if you believe in Human Biology.

*学校规定必须登记母亲的名字。以前父亲的名字是必须登记的,现在改成母亲的名字了,父亲的名字是可选填的。

*女性现已成为一家之主。自从我最近搬到浦那,我爸爸把配给卡从孟买转到了浦那。我听说了一件值得注意的事情,根据NFSA规定,无论收入多少,女性都将成为一家之主。

*证书上没有母亲的名字?我是2001年从孟买大学毕业的,我的毕业证书上有我母亲的名字和我父亲的名字。最近有消息说,单亲家庭的孩子只需要提供母亲姓名就可以办护照了,不再需要父亲的名字。

*婚礼开销:在印度的许多社区,甚至在我居住的马哈拉施特拉邦,人们分摊婚礼的开销。容我说一句,如果你对人类生物学有所了解,那么你应该知道蜜月不仅是男人的乐趣。我从没听说这笔费用需要均摊。

*孩子的监护权。不仅在印度,纵观世界各国,在大多数情况下,母亲都会获得孩子的监护权。Apolo Aton Ohno, 8枚奥运奖牌的得主是由他的父亲抚养的,对他的母亲不闻不问。

*女孩必须搬出娘家居住。我在孟买出生和长大,现在住在浦那。我看到很多夫妻住在独立的房子里,不和双方父母一起居住。那你为什么认为女孩必须离开她的父母?我有很多来自不同邦的朋友,有来自比哈尔邦的,北方邦, 泰米尔-纳德邦, 安得拉邦,德里邦,甚至马哈拉施特拉邦各地如戈尔,索拉普等工业化进程很慢或工作机会少的地区,所以他们不得不为了求学求职离开故乡。如果你认同人类生物学的话,你不觉得男人也一样会想家吗?

In short, ‘X’ was dominating ‘Y’, so now we are trying to make ‘Y’ more powerful than ‘X’ and hoping for an equality? that would rather become ‘Y’ dominated thing, isn’t it?

The problem is ground work. While counting the number of suffering women, we count all there in country but only few are able to take help of law. We are not promoting to ground level where women are in miserable condition. Rather making laws more & more biased making few women to take undue advantage and can lead to a female dominated thing what you mentioned.

All lawful rights should reach out to all women out there and not only to urban women since most of our population is in villages.

简而言之,“X”曾统治着“Y”,所以现在我们试图让“Y”比“X”更加强大,希望获得平等,让Y成为主导,不是吗?

问题在于基础。在统计受害妇女的数量时,我们统计了这个国家所有的妇女,但只有少数女性能够得到法律的援助。我们并没有提升妇女的悲惨处境。相反,我们制定了更为不公的法律,让一些女性获得了不正当利益,这将导致你说到的女性主导的问题。

所有的合法权利应该惠及所有的妇女,而不仅仅是城市妇女,因为我们的大部分人口都生活在农村。

 

Aravinda Chinnadurai

No.

Let me tell you based on my real experience today.

I work as RBSK doctor in Thirumanur block. So my job nature is to visit 105 schools and 122 anganwadi centres and screen children for diseases.

Today I visited a village named Melaramanallur a riverine island in the river Kollidam about 50 km from Thanjavur.

Though I planned for regular screening I was asked by deputy director to conduct measles and rubella vaccination program for the left out children in the past two days.

Since I was “asked” to conduct vaccination by my “boss” @ 11.30 am I arranged for vaccination by diverting my vehicle to the nearby PHC and got the vaccine vials, diluents and ice pack along with AEFI kits.

Since the vaccination is only for the absentees, I vaccinated 6 children (4 boys and 2 girls) from class 6 to 9. And I am bound to keep them under my observation for the next 2 hours.

So what would you do inside a remote village without internet ? I started speaking to those six children in a jovial manner and asked them some random things about cricket and mega serials they watch and slowly they opened about their life style in that village. Here are my few observations

不会。

让我根据我今天的实际经验来说道说道。

我在Thirumanur街区担任RBSK医生的职位。所以我的工作内容是走访105所学校和122个安甘瓦迪中心,为孩子们看病。

今天,我走访了一个名叫梅拉拉马纳罗的村庄,这是位于科利丹河上的一个内河岛屿,距离坦贾武尔大约50公里。

虽然我安排了定期筛查,但过去两天,副主任让我为尚未接种的儿童进行麻疹和风疹疫苗接种。

鉴于我的“顶头上司”“要求”我在11点30分进行疫苗接种,所以我调转车头,前往附近的卫生站,取回了疫苗瓶、稀释剂和冰袋以及AEFI试剂盒。

我为6至9班的6名儿童(4名男孩和2名女孩)接种了疫苗。我必须在接下来的两个小时里对他们进行观察。

那么在一个没有互联网覆盖的偏远村庄你会做什么呢?我开始和那六个孩子愉快地交谈,问问他们关于板球和连续剧的事情,慢慢地他们开始对我讲述他们那个村庄的生活方式。以下是我的一些观察:

  1. Girls are preferred to work after 10th std in tirupur textile industry and men were only preferred to study in nearby higher secondary school.
  2. Girls are required to wake up early to do all the household jobs while boys are not required to do such things.
  3. Among them 3 children (2 suicides) lost their fathers. And these fathers have more daughters than sons.
  4. Women in that village were married in their late teens or early twenties and don’t have any choice over when to have children , how much spacing can be done between pregnancy and more importantly when to have sterilization. All these were decide by their husbands and in laws.
  5. If you were not able to give birth to a male baby they are considered unlucky and made to keep on trying till they achieve. Till then they don’t have any respect in their family.
  6. The children if found any illness the care and response depends upon their sex and not the seriousness of the illness.

1. 父母希望女孩在10年级结束后进入蒂鲁普尔纺织厂工作,而男孩最好在附近的高中学习。

2. 父母要求女孩早起完成所有的家务,而男孩则不需要。

3. 这些孩子中有3人失去了父亲(2人自杀)。这些父亲的女儿比儿子多。

4. 村里的女性在十几岁或二十岁出头就结婚了,对于什么时候要孩子、怀孕间隔多长时间以及更重要的,什么时候进行绝育,她们没有任何选择权。这一切都是由她们的丈夫和公婆决定的。

5. 如果女人不能生育男孩,那是不幸的事,将被迫继续生,生到男孩为止。在那之前,女人在家里是得不到任何尊重的。

6. 如果孩子患上任何疾病,得到的照顾和反应取决于他们的性别,而不是疾病的严重程度。

I would now suggest the reader to draw their own conclusion and I am speaking about rural India based on my 2 years’ experience.

我建议读者自己推导结论,以上是我自己两年的印度农村的经验。

 

Sadhana Pandey

To an urban Indian man, who sees women all around him getting good education, getting financially independent and really having it all, it might seem like that tables have been turned.

In fact the one on Quora might even feel like women are taking over the world, since obviously every single question which even slightly hints toward misogynistic attitude receives a good beating from female as well as the male quorans.

But reality is very different. India is not made up of big cities. India lives in villages and small towns, and status of women though improved is still despicable in most part of the country, most of our women, still work like an ox and eat like birds quite literally.

对于一个印度城市男性来说,他看到的是:周围的女性都接受了良好的教育,经济独立,真正拥有了一切,这一切似乎已经改变了。

事实上,Quora上的人甚至会觉得女性正在统治世界,因为很明显,每个问题,只要有一丝歧视女性的苗头,都会受到女性和男性用户的强烈抨击。

但现实却截然不同。印度不是由大城市组成的。印度人生活在乡村和小城镇,妇女地位虽然提高了,但在大部分地区仍然卑下,我们大多数妇女,仍然吃得比鸟少,干得比牛多。

Most of Indian villages are now depopulated of men, women are left to do otherwise hard rural chores as well as farm work. Women have progressed in education but participation of women at important offices in fact overall public life is extremely low, they don't hold properties and have much less financial access, health indicators are also poor.

Urban women are also not that better off, since most of the families still follow a strict code for women, basically like rural women just not the drudgery of rural life.

如今,印度大多数村庄的男性人口都在减少,女性只能做辛苦的零工和农活。妇女在教育方面取得了进展,但妇女在重要机构上及公众生活的参与度非常低,她们没有财产,获得资金的机会也少得多,健康指标也很差。

城市妇女的生活也没有好到哪里去,因为大多数家庭仍然对妇女实行严格的管制,基本上和农村妇女一样,只是不需要做农村生活的苦差事罢了。

The all powerful, university educated, English speaking have it all class of Indian women is really very small, and in reality, we owe most of our new found fre m to the decency of men in our lives. It is our men who value our opinions, they are decent enough to acknowledge our aspirations and rights. Otherwise there are several women coming from all classes and financial status who are leading a miserable life just because men around them won't let them flourish and they don't have the courage to walk out.

A fraction of that class is present on Quora which you happen to see as the world dominated by women. In fact all the male bashing that goes on Quora also goes on because women believe that most of the men present here are decent men, they have a sense of justice and can differentiate right from wrong. And their somewhat misogynistic point of view is just a result of being raised in a world which is essentially like that. Otherwise no one really argues at lengths with supporting arguments and facts to total scum of earth.

拥有一切权力、受过大学教育、会说英语的印度女性阶层规模真的非常小,事实上,我们新获得的大部分自游都归功于我们生活中男人给我们的尊重。我们的男人重视我们的意见,他们认可我们的志向和权利。相反,也有来自各个阶层、不同经济地位的女人,因为周围的男人不让她们发展而没有勇气走出去,而过着悲惨的生活。

在Quora上能看到这一部分情况,你偶然瞥见世界被女性主宰的一角。事实上,在Quora上对男性的抨击也在继续,因为女性相信大多数男性都是正派的男人,他们有正义感,能够明辨是非。他们歧视女性的观点就源于在这样一个世界的成长经历。否则,没有人会真正地用论据和事实跟地球上的糟粕进行冗长的争论。

 

Vicky Ray, knows Anglo-Saxon Language

Not exactly, no.

The attempt is to a gender equal society which although is slow but for the good.

However, it’s leading to a different situation, and the side effects are showing already.

Double standards are persistent in many women, not only in India but also in the other countries in the west.

Firstly there are many women who get abused, mistreated, and are not offered education, especially in the rural areas. However, there are men as well, that get used as a walking ATM and many other purposes.

Many women still expect their dates, husbands and partners to pay for the bills when going to a restaurant, pub or any mall. If asked or requested to pay or even split the bill, they get furious label their partners or husbands as misers and some relationships even end there and then.

不是的。

我们的目标是建立一个性别平等的社会,这个社会虽然发展缓慢,但却是好的。

但这正在导致一种截然不同的后果,而且副作用也已经逐渐显现了。

双重标准在许多女性身上依然存在,不仅在印度,在其他西方国家也是如此。

首先,有很多妇女受到虐待,得不到教育,尤其是在农村地区。但也有一些男性,被女性用作行走的自动提款机和许多其他用途。

许多女性在餐馆、酒吧或购物中心时,还是希望自己的约会对象、丈夫和伴侣来买单。如果被要求分担费用,她们会愤怒地把自己的伴侣或丈夫贴上吝啬鬼的标签,有些甚至当场结束关系。

I would love to see my partner or wife to walk with me should to shoulder, so that we can survive together by sharing responsibilities equally, with love, trust and affection. I don't want her to depend on me alone. But it’s very rare to find women of that type.

If women want equal rights in every phase of life, be it in the society or workplace, they also have to contribute equally (if they are working) and share equal responsibilities. To be honest, that’s a very easy thing to do if both the partners have a good understanding and they love and respect each other. You just can’t take privileges and claim equality at the same time!

I had a girlfriend who is a doctor herself but she said that she would never spend a penny from her salary for our family expenditures. She even said that she might quit her job after marriage and that I should hand over all of my salary to her at the end of the month; she wasn't even joking!

我希望我的伴侣或妻子和我并肩前行,共同生活,平等地分担责任,爱,信任和感情。我不想让她依赖我。但这样的女性非常罕见。

如果女性在人生的各个阶段都想要平等的权利,无论是在社会上还是在工作场所,她们也必须平等地作出贡献(如果她们工作的话),分担同样的责任。老实说,只要双方能相互理解,彼此爱护和尊重,这是一件很容易做到的事情。你不能既要求平等,又要享受特权!

我有过一个女朋友,她自己也是医生,但她说绝不会从自己的工资中拿出一分钱,支付我们的家庭开销。她甚至说她可能会在结婚后辞职,而我要在月底把所有工资上交给她;她压根不是开玩笑的!

译文来源:阿巴森 http://www.abaripsen.com/p/51054.html 译者:Joyceliu

In a debate on one of the Facebook pages, one women even blatantly said that husbands can’t touch their wives' money, but it’s the duty of the husbands to take the entire responsibility of the family as they give birth. That made me fall from my chair!

In India, the women biased laws are being abused by many women for their means.

Many men commit suicide (suicide rate is higher than their female counterparts) as the don’t get any help from the police and India’s judiciary. False accusations of rape, dowry and domestic abuse are increasing every year, just like the usual issues that many good women face, either in public or at home. Many men get arrested and penalised by the police and the judiciary system, based merely on the accusations of their wives or partners, even if those men have sufficient evidence to prove themselves innocent.

Why do men have to provide financial support after a divorce even if it is initiated by their wives in every case and then lose custody of their children? Especially when women want divorce just because they want to live with a different man? This is not fair.

Facebook上有过一场辩论,一位女性公然表示,丈夫不能碰妻子的钱,妻子生了孩子,而丈夫必须对家庭担起全部责任。我惊得从椅子上摔了下去!

在印度,偏袒妇女的法律被许多妇女滥用。

由于得不到警方和印度司法部门的帮助,许多男性被迫自杀(自杀率高于女性)。对强奸、嫁妆和家暴的不实指控每年都在增加。许多男人仅仅因为妻子或伴侣的一面之词而被警察和司法系统逮捕、惩罚,即使这些男人拥有足够的证据证明自己是无辜的。

为什么男人在离婚后还要给前妻提供经济帮助,即使离婚是妻子要求的,同时还要失去孩子的监护权?尤其是有些女人只是想和另一个男人生活而离的婚?这不公平。

 

Tejasvita Apte

Not really, no. Other than the obvious things like female infanticide, crimes against women and domestic violence, the following is the reality of India -

  • Girls are still treated as a burden and Indian parents save for her wedding more than her education.
  • In almost all marriages, it is the bride’s side which bears the wedding expenses.
  • Almost all girls leave their own homes to live with the man and his family after marriage. In fact, that is the tacit understanding of every Indian marriage
  • Most Indian women are expected to (and end up) take their husband’s name and surname upon marriage.
  • Indian children take their father’s middle name and surname.
  • I am yet to see a man in India who asks “how do I balance work as well as the chores at home”.

I am sorry, but what kind of female dominance were you talking about?

实际上不是这样的。除了杀害女婴、反妇女犯罪和家庭暴丽等显而易见的事情,以下是印度的现实——

*女孩仍被视为负担,印度父母为她的婚礼攒的钱比为她的教育攒的更多。

*几乎所有的婚礼,都是新娘一方承担婚礼费用。

*几乎所有的女孩在结婚后都会离开自己的娘家,与男方和他的家人生活在一起。事实上,这是每一桩印度婚姻心照不宣的地方。

*大多数印度女性在结婚后会随夫姓。

*印度孩子继承父亲的中间名和姓氏。

*我还没见过哪个印度男人会问“如何在工作和家务之间取得平衡”。

所以很抱歉,你说的女性主导在哪里?

阿巴森原创译文,禁止转载!:首页 > 问答 » 印度会从一个男性主导的社会转变为女性主导吗

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